In this episode, Richard Pater speaks with Jonathan Harounoff Israel’s Spokesperson to the United Nations. They discuss relations with the UK and other missions, combatting anti-Israeli prejudice including the debate over recognition of Palestinian statehood, and the next steps for the international stabilisation effort in Gaza.
Jonathan was born in London, graduated with a degree in Arabic, Persian and Middle Eastern Studies at the University of Cambridge. He completed his graduate studies in international relations, journalism and diplomacy at Harvard and received his master’s from Columbia. Prior to the UN he worked as a journalist. He is also the author of Unveiled: Inside Iran’s #WomanLifeFreedom Revolt.
Transcript
(This transcript has been automatically generated by AI — please excuse any potential errors.)
00:00:06:24 – 00:00:29:18
Hello and welcome to the BICOM Podcast. I’m Richard Peter, the Director of BICOM. And today is the 20th of November. It is currently just gone 7 p.m. here in Jerusalem. And it’s midday in New York City, where I’m delighted to be joined by Jonathan Harounoff, who is the Israeli spokesperson for their delegation to the United Nations.
00:00:29:24 – 00:00:53:19
Jonathan, thank you very much indeed for joining me. Thanks for having me, Richard. Great to be with you. It’s an absolute pleasure. Perhaps we can start and you could briefly introduce yourself to our audience. Tell us a little bit about your background and how you came to represent Israel at the UN. Absolutely. I was born and raised in London, in north west London.
00:00:53:21 – 00:01:20:24
Two an Israeli mother, a British father, and Israeli and Iranian grandparents. So, growing up, I was surrounded by the beauty and the culture and the music and the art and the food. Coming from the Middle East, from Iran, Persian cuisine, Israeli food and music. And of course, you turn on the TV and then you hit, you see another aspect of this, this kind of dynamic.
00:01:20:24 – 00:01:47:23
You, you read and hear about the tensions that exist between these countries. So, the region has always been of personal and also professional fascination to me. After studying at university in the UK, where I studied, Arabic and Persian and Middle Eastern history and spent a year abroad in Morocco, where I am also doing some language work and other work.
00:01:48:00 – 00:02:17:13
I had the opportunity to move to the United States, where I worked in corporate communications, journalism again with a focus on the Middle East and, through a stroke of, I think, great, good fortune. Good luck. I had a chance to cover something at the United Nations where they were screening the. The Israeli mission to the UN was screening the harrowing 47-minute footage of a mass atrocities.
00:02:17:15 – 00:02:43:14
And something I wrote ended up on the ambassador’s desk. And that’s how we started the conversation. And this position came up and I thought, you know, it’s an opportunity of a lifetime to work at the United Nations, to represent Israel there, to work on media, and, and that’s how I ended up here, and that’s how I’ve been here for the past year and a half.
00:02:43:16 – 00:02:57:07
Fantastic. So, what can you tell us about kind of day-to-day life working at the, at the UN? Obviously, especially with the focus, as you say, over the last year, which must have been incredibly intense.
00:02:57:09 – 00:03:26:23
Well, it’s been a very busy year. It’s been a very turbulent year. There’s been ups, there have been downs. There’s been a lot of heartbreak, and there’s there also have been moments of absolute elation and joy. And the same can be said of inside the UN. My primary task is to, you know, work on the, the media relations journalists, hold press conferences and sort of work on all of the media related matters related to Israel at the United Nations.
00:03:27:00 – 00:03:54:20
And, you know, some of the more memorable moments for me personally at the United Nations has been to use, you know, for all of all of the United Nations, flaws and faults and the effects of which there are many. It still has a global platform. The world is still watching when there’s a notable Security Council session taking place or a General Assembly meeting, or a delegation coming here of, of sorts.
00:03:55:00 – 00:04:29:22
So, the world is watching. And Israel, as a very long-standing member of member state of the United Nations, is using this platform, this to, to send it. So the message and one thing that we’ve done numerous times to I think a tremendous success is elevate the voices of recently released hostages and families of hostages who hadn’t yet been released or who had, been killed and bringing them to the United Nations for the specific reason that at their time of need, the United Nations never came to them.
00:04:29:24 – 00:05:16:02
So, we brought recently released hostages like, Mia Shem, Eli Sharabi, Noa Argamani, Ilana Ilana Gritzewsky and a few others as well. And brought them to the General Assembly or the Security Council, where they sat around the infamous table and spoke directly to the ambassadors and to the world about their own harrowing experiences. And being a part of that effort was, tremendously, I think, gratifying and tremendously powerful as well, because it’s one thing for, you know, Israel to, an Israeli representative to, to deliver a message to explain why Israel is doing what it’s doing, whether it’s in relation to Lebanon or the Islamic Republic or Hamas in Gaza.
00:05:16:04 – 00:05:39:01
But I think it’s a totally separate and, and, and endeavour, to bring someone who can speak first hand of their experiences. So that’s, that’s in a nutshell, the kind of work that we’ve been doing here. I’m sure that must be incredibly powerful to bring the, the, the, the released hostages to the, to the attention of the of the diplomats.
00:05:39:05 – 00:05:43:21
Can you give us a flavour of any of the other highlights that you can talk about for the last year?
00:05:43:23 – 00:06:10:18
Well, I don’t know if I would describe it as this highlights, but there have been some moments of intense, tension and where we’ve been holding certain, UN officials to account for falling short of, of their own mandate for using misusing their platforms to demonize and de-legitimize the State of Israel as opposed to fulfilling their own mandate in a sort of professional and unbiased manner.
00:06:10:20 – 00:06:44:15
So when at a time when you have certain senior officials, claiming, for example, very erroneously clearly that 14,000 babies are on the verge of, of dying in Gaza, which of course, is, is, a horrific thing, to state, and when it we, you know, and it already made its rounds around the world. So, one thing that that the Israeli mission did in the Israeli ambassador to the UN, Danny Danon, did very and proficiently and effectively was refute that.
00:06:44:15 – 00:07:26:12
And illustrate just how dangerous words can be, because sometimes it’s forgotten, especially at a time of war where there’s not so much focus on physical kinetic warfare. Sometimes people forget just how dangerous words can be as well, and especially when they’re coming from people of significant authority that carry weight. And that, I assume to be true when those senior officials say things like that, when a special rapporteur with the UN, title, say things that are just completely, false or completely antisemitic, then, that’s dangerous as well, that that carries a lot of danger.
00:07:26:12 – 00:07:47:21
And that’s something that we’ve been trying to highlight as well, not just the kind of, you know, physical warfare that that’s been taking place and the physical conflict that was sprung on Israel on October the 7th, but also the information war that is taking place on multiple domains, including here at the United Nations. I’ll come back and ask you about that.
00:07:47:21 – 00:08:12:21
But I was just wondering, with your kind of with your expertise, both as a former journalist and now as a, as a spokesperson, I wonder if you could give us a flavour of the, of the of the of the, the media. What’s the landscape, I suppose, covering the UN and as we, as you’re talking to become, and we have a, a preference for the Brits kind of how prominent all the other British journalist within that landscape.
00:08:12:23 – 00:08:40:16
Well, I think you see two realities that the United Nations, when it comes to journalists and coverage media, one is around the high-level week, September time, where all the leaders come to the United Nations. There’s a lot of buzz, there’s a lot of commotion. And you saw that this September as well, especially with all of the talk around recognition, you know, and during those times, there’s tremendous coverage.
00:08:40:17 – 00:09:15:00
There’s, full coverage. The UK sends, you know, every single, every single outlet is represented here in full. And the coverage is quite comprehensive. But during ordinary times like if you can say any time is ordinary when it comes to the UN in the Middle East, like now, the coverage is, is less robust. And I think it’s just a matter of, you know, realistic matter of lack of bandwidth and lack of focus, focusing on other things.
00:09:15:02 – 00:09:45:00
So, in terms of physical presence, it’s not always that robust. The BBC, for example, does have a presence here. And of course, whenever there’s something very significant happening at the UN, the UK outlets are covering them probably more remotely, whether it’s channel four or ITV. But in terms of actual physical presence here, I would say that presence is more, style and seen in DC if, if I have to think anywhere in the US.
00:09:45:02 – 00:10:09:18
But in general, if I had to characterize the kind of the media coverage, from correspondents who are based here on a regular basis, I would say that I have good relations with almost all of them and relationships with almost all of them. And some of them are extremely professional and good at what they do and open minded and they go through the necessary steps of requesting comment, interviews, things like that.
00:10:09:18 – 00:10:33:11
But of course, that’s not everyone. And we’ve, and we’ve had to, you know, figure out who makes sense to speak to and who’s going to give, you know, room for comment and not sort of distort anything that said or anything that’s not said as well. And who we should, who we should approach and who we shouldn’t approach.
00:10:33:13 – 00:10:56:12
Okay. It’s a very diplomatic answer but thank you. You mentioned before about kind of the role in the information war, I suppose one of the, one of our biggest criticisms of the of the UN is that the UN itself, as an institution, often takes, data and information supplied from Hamas. Particularly I’m talking in reference to the to the conflict in Gaza.
00:10:56:14 – 00:11:29:23
And then repeats it as its own as it has its own, data point. I mean, do you share that concern and what can be done? How would you how do you go about rectifying that? It’s certainly a concern. And when these, statistics lacking context, which is lacking any, any basis of reality has sort of given the UN stamp of approval and the emanating from the Hamas run Gaza Health Ministry or another kind of institution within Hamas’s, governance.
00:11:30:00 – 00:11:49:06
It’s extremely dangerous and, and it’s, it’s a trap that I think the UN and its officials have fallen into multiple times. You do see, sometimes the media outlets who were citing these figures sometimes say that, you know, they do the minimum and say that these are Hamas run figures. But sometimes even that basic minimum is lacking.
00:11:49:12 – 00:12:16:15
I think if you’re asking me what else should be done, the obvious thing is that the UN has to be more comprehensive in and, and more, rounded in sort of the sources that it draws on, not just, problematic sources. And it also needs to have very clear disclaimers when it’s citing things, that that is the source that they’re citing from.
00:12:16:15 – 00:12:37:23
And if that is the only source which they may say in response, then making it clear that that’s the only source and this is what we have to work with. But that context is usually lacking quite a lot, and especially in the speech delivered, for example, in the Security Council chamber, where they’re just stating figures without, you know, citing sources.
00:12:38:00 – 00:12:59:24
And then those quotes, you know, reverberate around the world in authority. You know, it’s just like an endless cycle that’s, that’s extremely dangerous. And it’s what it’s usually how, stories lacking any, any basis, end up circulating online and getting a lot of traction even when they don’t actually, have any basis of truth.
00:13:00:01 – 00:13:17:11
Yeah. We are familiar with this, with this, with this challenge, on the diplomatic front, what can you tell us about, the relations you have with other with other missions there? Again, as we’re by become I have a particular interest in the Brits, but maybe also amongst the, the Arab and Muslim world.
00:13:17:13 – 00:13:47:24
Well, there are 193 member states here. And it would be untrue to say that Israel has no allies at the UN. Sometimes, you know, the amount of animosity and hostility emanating from these halls may suggest that. But the reality is that Israel does have allies here. And whether they, you know, declare that they’re open support for Israel in public or private, there are allies and even with allies, on certain matters.
00:13:48:01 – 00:14:03:24
with the UK, for example, who is a close ally of Israel, sometimes there are disagreements, but I think that’s the nature of a relationship of a, of a strong relationship where you have sort of a good, a good enough relationship to agree on certain things and to disagree on others.
00:14:03:24 – 00:14:16:18
And, and one point of serious contention and disagreement was, you know, August in the lead up to the September high level week, the whole, saga around, recognition and,
00:14:16:20 – 00:14:26:21
and how it was the wrong place and the wrong time to do that while there were still hostages, held in Gaza. But they are relations there.
00:14:26:21 – 00:15:14:22
Of course, there are discussions being had behind the scenes, with various nations. And my hope is that as we, as the, the second phase of and the thornier phase of this, 20 point peace plan, the Gaza peace plan was just ratified in the Security Council got the seal of approval, I hope will move on to, you know, an era of peace and prosperity and, conflict free Middle East where other countries can, can be more have more of an incentive to make peace with Israel as opposed to, siding with, with other forces that are focused more on driving conflict and, and divide division in the region.
00:15:14:24 – 00:15:38:08
Absolutely. Just on the, on the recognition, I don’t know, have you I mean, I don’t expect you to reveal any, any confidential, conversations, but could you give us a flavour? The since the British move for unilateral recognition, have you had any conversations with the Brits there that understand? Maybe it didn’t even serve their own purposes to reach a two-state solution, if that’s their desired outcome.
00:15:38:11 – 00:16:05:12
Has there been any, and any follow up on that? I think just reality Follow was the greatest follow up in many ways because, you know, you saw a lot of noise and commotion coming out of the UN around the time of I love a week, a lot of nations, including the UK and Australia and other places, were very seen to be very proud of themselves, passing themselves on the back for making these declarations of statehood and recognition.
00:16:05:14 – 00:16:30:02
But no, but that didn’t actually change the reality on the ground. There was still war raging, the hostages still hadn’t been returned, and the only real change that you started to see took place sort of away from the confines of the UN at the white House the following week, where President Trump and Prime Minister Netanyahu unveiled this 20 point peace plan with the UN very much on the sidelines.
00:16:30:02 – 00:17:02:07
And I think that is sort of, quite a damning indictment of where we are in the world today and what kind of role the UN is playing. So, in answer to your question, I think just reality crept up and it sort of illustrates that that wasn’t the right time. It wasn’t it didn’t make sense to go from A to Z without filling in any of the blanks in between and the peace plan, while also, having its imperfections because it’s a, it’s a negotiation and that involves compromise.
00:17:02:07 – 00:17:27:22
And on Israel’s side, the compromise involved releasing convicted terrorists, which is extremely painful. But that was the reality that that is what actually drove, a breakthrough in the region. And it wasn’t the those, declarations of recognition, that really moved the needle, at a time when the needle really did need to be moved at a drastic pace.
00:17:27:24 – 00:17:49:07
Absolutely. I mean, you just mentioned, you know, we’re talking, and one of the reasons why I wanted to talk to you this week was after that, very significant and fateful vote in the Security Council this week, you mentioned about the, kind of the building blocks or putting some meat on the bones of the Trump plan and getting the, the, the Security Council’s endorsement.
00:17:49:09 – 00:18:14:14
What do you where do you see this playing out kind of the next stage, in the implementation of the, the Trump plan and the, the international Stabilization Force? Look, it’s certainly a positive move that 13 Security Council members endorsed the plan. And nobody, none of the permanent members vetoed it, even though Russia and China abstained.
00:18:14:16 – 00:18:46:12
That’s certainly a positive move. It’s positive that we can now begin the much, I think, hefty task of actually figuring out and discussing how to disarm Hamas, how to dismantle their regime, how to demilitarize the area and how to move the region. That part of the world forward. You know, the first phase, even though we’re still not done with the first phase, because there is still, as of the time of this recording, at least three bodies still held, by Hamas.
00:18:46:12 – 00:19:09:02
And so, we’re still not fully done with that. But I think what happened at the Security Council earlier this week, was a very important step because many of the parties involved, especially the Muslim majority and Arab nations. I believe once it’s that UN thing of approval in order to feel more comfortable moving into this next step.
00:19:09:02 – 00:19:38:15
But the reality is we’re still very much in the early days, and time will tell. Just, you know, how and who and when Hamas is going to be disarmed. And it’s, I don’t think anyone is under any illusion that that would be a straightforward task, especially since, it’s important to note that Hamas terrorist organization themselves didn’t, endorse didn’t seem particularly pleased with the outcome of the Security Council resolution policy.
00:19:38:17 – 00:20:11:09
They, in fact, that they don’t support it because they don’t want to be disarmed. So, it’s not a straightforward task in some. And I think time will tell. In terms of just who and how, we’re going to achieve this next phase. Yeah. I mean, what should we be looking out as kind of for the listeners and, and can observers to this, I mean, you know, on one level, is it kind of the IDF are the only force capable of enforcing any form of the disarming of Hamas?
00:20:11:11 – 00:20:37:18
And unless the kind of heavy diplomatic pressure is placed on Hamas, I suppose, kind of primarily through them through their allies, Qatar, Qatar and Turkey, I mean, how do you see the prospect of that, of that playing out and, the prospects of disarmament? Well, heavy diplomatic pressure, I think, was one of the key ingredients in the breakthrough for the first phase and for the ceasefire coming into action in the first place.
00:20:37:18 – 00:21:02:17
So, if you see a similar level of incentive and pressure, then that could be a mark of success. And in terms of the United States that President Trump and his administration have been, tremendously important and pivotal in, in helping bring about peace here. And it’s clear that they want to move forward. It’s in everyone’s interest.
00:21:02:19 – 00:21:22:07
Nobody here wants Israel if that’s and he doesn’t want war. It’s been extremely painful and debilitating. And for everyone in the in the country, everyone’s lost someone. Everyone’s had people affected by this war and ready to move on, ready to move forward to the expansion of the Abraham Accords and more positive change in the region.
00:21:22:09 – 00:21:43:03
So, I think, you know, and another thing to look out for is, you know, how this, Board of Peace ends up shaping up, who ends up sitting there? What’s that? What kind of actions have taken that? And I’m sure President Trump is going to play a very key role there as well. So, there’s a lot to look out for.
00:21:43:03 – 00:22:26:00
But what I would look out for is, is how much pressure, the, the, involved parties are putting on, on Hamas, to actually come to the table to, to, to actively disarm. And, and what happens with the Board of Peace and, and of course, Israel, like, like early many member states don’t want to say it, but many member states are very quick to condemn Israel for the actions they take, and then they’re usually the only ones left to do the dirty work, whether it’s dismantling Hamas and decapitating Hezbollah, launching Operation Washing Line on the Islamic Republic.
00:22:26:00 – 00:22:31:07
So, there are many member states that are very quick to condemn, but not actually quick to take any action themselves.
00:22:31:10 – 00:23:04:10
And you just mentioned, I mean, obviously, here in Israel, people are very, excited, expectant at some point in the near future, foresee an expansion of the Abraham Accords. I don’t expect you to name names unless you want to, of course, but can you just give us a sense if there are countries Muslim, Arab countries that don’t currently have diplomatic relations, who you’ve seen any signs of, kind of using, using the, the safe space of the UN to, to, to reach, to reach out even tentatively.
00:23:04:12 – 00:23:29:12
I think we’re seeing a lot of optimism in general, even not speaking specifically about the UN, that there is a sense that we’re even though we’re not quite out of the woods yet, but we’ve turned a corner and there’s a lot of optimism and hope and that there’s this is, like a mutually beneficial prospect. This isn’t a, something that would purely benefit Israel.
00:23:29:12 – 00:24:00:20
This is something this is a sort of situation, realization for many of these countries that we’re entering a sort of different era now. And if you want your country and your people, to enter this, this period of time of, of great economic prosperity, peace, trade, all kinds of cooperation and resource sharing and tourism and cultural exchange.
00:24:00:22 – 00:24:27:16
You know, it’s there’s a tremendous, incentive here to, to, to take part in this enterprise. And it’s not just countries in the Middle East that you’re seeing potential for interest, beyond the Middle East, elsewhere. And I, I’m very hopeful. I don’t think it’s going to be overnight. And there are certain countries, big and small, that I think are entertaining this and where they wouldn’t have entertained it.
00:24:27:18 – 00:24:53:24
In the past. And I think it goes also to show you just how much has changed in the past few also years, you know, right before, as we all know, right before October 7th, 2023, there was tremendous momentum towards potential Saudi Israeli normalization. Of course, that got derailed with the October 7th atrocities. But I think we’re now getting back into that original line of, of peace building.
00:24:53:24 – 00:25:16:14
And even if it’s not with Saudi Arabia immediately and it may take some time, the other nations that are actively stating, interest, whether it’s Kazakhstan or other nations as well, that you may not have thought would have been interested in the past. So, it’s definitely an optimistic period of time. But it may take some time.
00:25:16:16 – 00:25:39:13
Great. If I could just kind of slightly change tack and ask you. You are also the author of a new book unveiled inside Iran’s Women Life Freedom Revolt. What can you tell us? For those that haven’t read it about the genesis of the book and what your overall thesis is?
00:25:39:15 – 00:26:09:01
So, well, important context is that I was a journalist for around seven years covering Israel and Iran, and I have a very strong personal attachment to this region with, grandparents coming from the area. And something that I found quite interesting was that most of the time, the news is very can be quite comprehensive when it.
00:26:09:01 – 00:26:33:17
Come on Iran, when it comes to talking about its, its nuclear weapons program and its proxies and its foreign policy and all of that stuff that’s externally facing. But when it comes to actually what’s going on inside Iran with the 92 million people there, who they are, what kind of relationship they have with their regime, what their outlook is on, on the United States and Israel and the West.
00:26:33:17 – 00:27:07:17
There’s very little information on that. And of course, it’s an access issue. But I think there are other reasons, behind that as well. And one thing I wanted to do was to speak directly to Iranians inside Iran, and also in the diaspora, who’ve experienced firsthand the brutality of the regime and, what their hopes are for the future and the writing of the book, which took around three years, coincided with this massive women led uprising that took place in September of 2022.
00:27:07:19 – 00:28:01:09
Following the killing of a young Iranian Kurdish woman called Master Gina Romine, who was killed at the hands of the morality police. And the book traces the origins and the successes and, of course, the shortcomings of this movement, but looks more broadly at the 46 year history of protests that have taken place inside the regime and also touches on and makes a very clear distinction between the 92 million people of Iran, the vast majority of whom don’t support their government, and the 46 year old regime that has appeared to have been since is very foundation and inception, hell bent on the subjugation and oppression of women and minorities and the, virulent distancing
00:28:01:09 – 00:28:09:19
and demonization and desire to annihilate the State of Israel and destroy the West.
00:28:09:21 – 00:28:36:03
It’s fascinating. And I just wondered if you could kind of, just off the back of that kind of, you know, after the 12 day war with Iran, if you could just give us your current assessment, on the, on where Iran stands, both in terms of its, internal, fortitude of the regime, and as well as kind of the ongoing threat it faces with the both nuclear and conventional threat.
00:28:36:05 – 00:29:09:18
I think it’s there’s no question that the Islamic Republic is, is vulnerable at this point in time. And what we saw in June, with operations rising line and midnight hammered the US and the UK and Israel, dealt damaging blows to their military infrastructure. Of course, in their, nuclear program, etc. that can significantly. And I know you had, two great experts from Fadi who I am know well and they do amazing work who went into that more in greater detail.
00:29:09:20 – 00:29:45:14
Thank you for being a listener. Contributor? Of course. But, I think another aspect here that doesn’t really get touched on is that I think a much greater existential threat that the Islamic Republic is facing is certainly from within the fact that it’s facing a very, very, debilitating and dangerous, domestic crisis, this massive order shortages that are not being sufficiently reported about online, and not just that, the fact that the regime appears not to not take the situation very seriously.
00:29:45:14 – 00:30:11:19
And this is, Iran is currently in its fifth consecutive year of drought. If you look at Tehran itself, many officials, including the president of the country, Masood possess given is warning that the country that the city megacity of around 10 million people could run out of water in an instance, and that many lakes and reservoirs are taking essentially their last breaths.
00:30:11:21 – 00:30:36:16
And if you look at one particular dam, the known as the, make a big dam, which is one of five major reservoirs responsible for supplying drinking water to Tehran, it’s currently at 8% capacity. If you look at, 20 of the country’s 31 provinces, they haven’t they haven’t had any rainwater when it rains since March of 2025.
00:30:36:16 – 00:31:05:01
This is an extremely serious issue. And instead of and it’s a result of decades and decades of corruption, water mismanagement, overdevelopment, all sorts of issues, and also mis allocating resources elsewhere instead of inside to Iran to, mis allocate, reallocating it elsewhere, nuclear weapons program proxies. People of Iran are noticing this, and the regime isn’t taking it seriously.
00:31:05:03 – 00:31:41:05
In this over the summer, when the problem was especially acute, we saw some officials blaming Israel for the water crisis, saying that Israel had moved the clouds. And, more recently, you’ve seen a number of clerics say that, actually, this is God’s punishment to Iranians because of the women who’ve been, unveiling their hair. And also, it’s a punishment to, government officials who haven’t enforced the regime’s strict dress codes rigidly enough.
00:31:41:05 – 00:32:08:05
So, so that’s sort of where many of the people, many of the regime officials are at, and it sort of highlights just the sort of importance and seriousness that they’re attaching to this situation. So they certainly the, the military, external facing pressures that the Islamic Republic is facing, no doubt. And Israel and other countries are monitoring it closely.
00:32:08:07 – 00:32:33:02
You see, and even Europeans with the E3 here in the Security Council recognize that these republics, not fulfilling its obligations when it comes to the nuclear side, but I think something that really deserves an equal or greater amount of attention is what’s happening inside Iran. And what is the what the international institutions and Western governments doing to raise awareness and to support the people of Iran.
00:32:33:04 – 00:32:40:12
Well, said. That on that on that message. We will leave it there. But, Jonathan, thank you very much indeed for talking to me today.
00:32:40:12 – 00:32:42:17
Thank you so much, Richard. I appreciate it.